The Legend of Zelda: Essence of the Triforce

[MammonMachine]

What do you mean press a button to stop? Nothing is stopping.

I personally don't care if it gets added or not. It's not my game, and it's not my problem.

I will however, point out this issue for anyone who gives a damn. The combat in it's current state doesn't feel right because of this.


It's sad to see a good game go to waste over something like this, so if anything, for the love of God make the 1,2,3,4 number keys change Link's direction when pressed. He doesn't have to move anywhere, just change his direction.

[Pythis]

-_- "Go to waste like this" Who the hell cares if he cant change direction. If anyone else gave a damn they'd post.

[MammonMachine]

Fine, keep it the way you have it now.


I suppose it can work if all the enemies are dumb as rocks and never actually walk toward Link. And I'm sure people won't have problems fighting if they are always attacking things head on.



Of course, keep in mind you are limiting the combat capabilities. (Example: Any enemy that can stay within 2 tiles to the side or behind Link will always be impossible to hit unless the player takes damage by walking into the enemy in order to face his direction)

[Darthcourt]

Originally posted by MammonMachine
Of course, keep in mind you are limiting the combat capabilities. (Example: Any enemy that can stay within 2 tiles to the side or behind Link will always be impossible to hit unless the player takes damage by walking into the enemy in order to face his direction)

Not two tiles.
If he wants to walk up he can just tap up and turn around and attack.
Just that simple.
I understand your point.
But if you think of it most of the 2d Zelda games have that defect.
Overall this is the best zelda system Ive seen.

*edit*
Are you going to have a bottle system in this game?

[Chaotic_Death]

Originally posted by MammonMachine
Well if the default RM2k keys don't work, then why not just program another set of keys to emulate the directional keys?

I really don't think the combat is going to work all that well with it's current method.

In order to attack any enemy that stands next to you, you'd have to make a minimum of 4 steps just so you can face his direction and attack him.

Keep in mind though, that the enemies don't stand still, and if you take those 4 steps and they stand next to you AGAIN you have to take another 4 steps. Ouch. What happens when you have hordes of monsters surrounding you?

You just answered your own question there...  You said the enemies don't stand still.  Yes, of course.  So just wait for them to move.  Besides, moving four tiles will take you... what?  Two seconds?  Also, I doubt you'll be surrounded by a horde of enemies...  Their movement is set to "random."

Originally posted by MammonMachine
Fine, keep it the way you have it now.

I suppose it can work if all the enemies are dumb as rocks and never actually walk toward Link. And I'm sure people won't have problems fighting if they are always attacking things head on.

Of course, keep in mind you are limiting the combat capabilities. (Example: Any enemy that can stay within 2 tiles to the side or behind Link will always be impossible to hit unless the player takes damage by walking into the enemy in order to face his direction)

The enemies /are/ dumb as rocks.  I'm not going to take the time to program an AI for every one of them.  Also, not two tiles.  Just one, what Darthcourt said.

Yes, I'm leaving it the way it is.  If you don't like it, then go ahead and make your own Zelda game with the movement in it that you want.  That or stop complaining.

@Darthcourt: Yes, it already does

[Darthcourt]

Yay! =D
I cant wait to see the menu system in action!

[MammonMachine]

You mean the enemies don't even use the "Move toward Hero" movement? I can't see why the hell you wouldn't do that. Players are just gonna laugh their way through monsters.  And writing AIs isn't that difficult anyway. You only have to write them once and then make all the right monsters use the right AI. It could be something as simple as using a shield when getting attacked or healing when health is low or whatever.


And this thread has indeed inspired me to create an engine of my own. Not for a game of any sort, but just to serve as some kind of proof of concept. It's focus will only be on combat. I'm going to incorporate:

-General Combat
-General NPC AI
-The ability to face a direction
-Spin attacks
-Throwing Pots and Objects
-Strafing while shooting arrows
-Shielding
-Horse mounted combat


and then after that I'll probably try a few more things and call it a day and delete it.

[AsakuraHao2004]

Mammon, you seem to have some interesting ideas. I would like to see an engine designed by you.

Also, I have to agree it is kinda dumb not to make enemies move towards the hero. Basically you could sit your antagonist in a corner, leave your computer for a smoke, come back, and be completly unschated. Of course, making the enemy 2 tiles away is kinda dumb, unless you tie it into the story, like the hero carries a really long sword that only works from afar.

[Chaotic_Death]

EDIT: This was in responce to Mammon.  Askura hadn't posted by the time I started writing this.

That's nice, though there's already shielding in EotT.
Straffing with arrows could simply be added, I just didn't put it in.
Lifting and throwing pots/bushes is possible, but I didn't add it in due to the amount of glitches it would bring.
Who said there won't be any horse-mounted combat in the game?
By spin attack you mean you hold down the button and your sword charges up?  Psh, have fun.

No, AI would have to be programmed per enemy.  Sure, they use the same code, but variables and switches would be different for each one.  Thus, each one would need their own set of them.

And no, there's no "Move Towards Hero" ...
The enemies would easily surround you, killing you within seconds.

As you argue more and more, I'm starting to think you've never played a Zelda game before.  Basic enemies in REAL Zelda games have RANDOM MOVEMENT.  You don't see them moving towards Link, now do you?  And I've recorded a movie from Minish Cap to prove my point.  Just wait a bit while I upload it.

Sure, there are some enemies with AI, but only very few.  Heck, even half of the bosses don't have any AI.  They just emit attacks at random.

EDIT:

http://www.elavismo.avalonsmist.com/tlozeott/Real%20Zelda%20Enemies.zip

[MammonMachine]

Thinking back, that might be true.

But my engine isn't going to be a direct Zelda Clone.

I want to make something more intense.



P.S. I'm surprised that your not putting in a Spin Attack. Really, it's not the hardest thing in the world. It just takes work, but it's not at all impossible.

[Chaotic_Death]

Originally posted by MammonMachine
Thinking back, that might be true.

But my engine isn't going to be a direct Zelda Clone.

I want to make something more intense.

P.S. I'm surprised that your not putting in a Spin Attack. Really, it's not the hardest thing in the world. It just takes work, but it's not at all impossible.

That's not my goal.  I'm trying to make this more Zelda-ish than my-own-game-ish, if that made any sense.  Yours sounds interesting, though.  I'd like to play it when you're all finished if that's okay.

About the spin attack: Oh, I know that.  I'm just having it as a seperate thing you have to learn on a different button that will cost you magic to use.  I don't feel like putting the time into making it combo-in with the normal slash.

[MammonMachine]

If you made the spin attack a seperate button, wouldn't that make it overpowered? Unless you had some sort of delay?

[Chaotic_Death]

Well...

- You can't move while you're using the spin attack.
- You only spin once, then yes, there's a delay
- If you're out of magic, you can't use it

[Meiscool-2]

Just to go back to the topic said about having
you press the left arrow key to turn left
NOT walk left, couldn't you just make a
key to turn left instead? Like A would
be turn or look right, W would be
up, D left, and S down. I have no clue
if you can do this, as I've never tried to
add different key codes in my rpgs, but
just something to look into.

Edit- A would be left, and D right

[Meiscool-2]

Oh crap, i just realized that someone
already posted something like that for
the 1234 keys. Sorry of the double
posting.

Also as a side note, the spin attack would
act as the four-steps needed to change
facing. Because it attacks all around you,
you wouldn't have to worry about your facing.

For another side note
For the enemy AI, (just a sugggestion) couldn't
you put in something simple to make the game
harder but purposful at the same time? If the
monsters never move toward you, the whole
system of fighting will seem pointless. So I would
do it this way.

Monster 1- Make your event repeat this custom pattern:
                - Move random
                - Move toward hero
                - Move random

Or, to keep the monster AI but add challenge, put it this way:

Monster 2- Random movement
                - Movement frequeny 1/2 normal
                - Movement speed set at four

When I played your game I also noticed that you
only got damaged when you walked into a monster,
and I know you already wrote something about this
many pages back saying "you will die to easily if I set
it to collision" or  something to that suit of words. Well,
I was bored one day so I screwed around with your
monster AI and found that you do not die to easily.
You only take one point of damage every second, not
all at once, and the smart Zelda player would bat the
monster off with his sword before it took to much away.
I don't know if you've already switched that or talked some
more about it, because I don't read each and every post
on here, just ones that look interesting. The rest I just
skim through, but I do look at them never the less.